[visionlist] immunity from illusions (particularly visual illusions)

Caspar M. Schwiedrzik schwiedrzik at mpih-frankfurt.mpg.de
Mon Feb 13 09:18:50 EST 2017


here is a nice paper looking at the neural basis of inter-individual
differences in apparent motion: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21885284


2017-02-13 15:08 GMT+01:00 Andrei Gorea <andrei.gorea at parisdescartes.fr>:

> Richard Gregory tried once (in his own opinion, not quite successfully) to
> classify the illusions (Phil.Trans. R. Soc. Lond. B (1997) 352, 1121-1128;
> TICS (1997, 1(5) 190-193). It is clear that Müller-Lyer is not of the same
> type as the motion after-effect. In fact, what an illusion is remains an
> undecided (philosophical?) question (see Michael Morgan, *The space
> between our ears*, Oxford UP, 2003).
>
> I do not see how a person who doesn't experience the M-L illusion would
> not experience a MAE. Is the latter an "illusion". If yes, then everything
> is, so that "not experiencing *anything*" is to be blind, deaf, etc.
>
> Andrei
>
>
>
> At 14:34 13/02/2017, Tom Freeman wrote:
>
> As Qaisim says, individual differences in illusions/perceptual biases have
> been neglected (as IDs in perception have in general).
>
> Grist to the mill: Georgie Powell and I have just published an account of
> individual differences in two well-known motion illusions, based on
> differences in certain features of motion priors, as well as differences in
> motion sensitivity.
>
> http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/0956797616665351
>
> Cheers Tom
>
> --------------------------------------
> School of Psychology
> Tower Building
> Park Place
> Cardiff CF10 3AT UK
> +44(0)2920874554 <+44%2029%202087%204554>
> psych.cf.ac.uk/contactsandpeople/academics/freeman.html
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: visionlist [ mailto:visionlist-bounces at visionscience.com
> <visionlist-bounces at visionscience.com>] On Behalf Of Michael Herzog
> Sent: 12 February 2017 17:33
> To: Qasim Zaidi <qz at sunyopt.edu>; moorek at arcadia.edu
> Cc: visionlist at visionscience.com
> Subject: Re: [visionlist] immunity from illusions (particularly visual
> illusions)
>
> Dear All
> We just recently reported that there are few significant correlations
> between illusion magnitudes: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27919676
> Thus, maybe just an instantiation of variability......
> All the best
> Michael
>
> Qasim Zaidi wrote:
> > There are individual differences, but they have not been much studied
> > until the recent push by Jeremy Willmer at VSS.
> >
> > I had a brilliant undergraduate at Columbia, who went on to be a star
> > grad student at MIT, has done start-ups, been CTO of multiple
> > companies, won an Emmy, etc etc, and he had no simultaneous brightness
> > or color induction, as measured by objective methods (nulling on a
> > 2AFC adaptive staircase).  He was also a meticulous observer in motion
> > experiments, where he saw all kinds of effects.
> >
> > You may want to see what else is different about these students.  I
> > suspect that they will be normal on low level detection and
> > discrimination experiments, but that may still be worth checking.
> >
> > Cheers
> > QZ
> >
> > Qasim Zaidi PhD
> > SUNY Distinguished Professor
> >
> > Graduate Center for Vision Research,
> > State University of New York College of Optometry,
> > 33 West 42nd St, New York, NY  10036.
> > Office: 212-938-5542 <(212)%20938-5542>; Lab: 212-938-5756
> <(212)%20938-5756>; Fax: 212-938-5537 <(212)%20938-5537>
> > E-mail: qz at sunyopt.edu < mailto:qz at sunyopt.edu <qz at sunyopt.edu>>
> > http://poseidon.sunyopt.edu/Zaidi/index.php
> >
> > *"Dr. Katherine Moore" <moorek at arcadia.edu
> > < mailto:moorek at arcadia.edu <moorek at arcadia.edu>>>
> > writes:*
> > Dear vision experts,
> >
> >
> > I was hoping some of you could help me out with something that made me
> > curious all of last semester. Last semester was about the fifth time
> > I've taught Sensation & Perception. Even though my classes are small
> > (less than 25 students), each time I teach this course I have a
> > student or two who is unusual in some sensory way -- just one working
> > eye, synesthesia, no sense of smell, blind, prosopagnosia, etc.
> >
> >
> > This past semester I had two students who did not experience illusions
> > (out of just 10 students!) One of them truly did not experience any of
> > the illusions. Another did not experience the vast majority of them.
> > We mostly did visual illusions, but among the few auditory illusions
> > we did, these students didn't experience them either. I have no reason
> > to think the students were lying about it--they are very sincere people.
> > And they both had trouble with an assignment that required students to
> > view some new illusions, describe what they saw and what was really
> > happening, and explain the illusion. These two students didn't see
> > what the rest of the class saw, and only saw "what was really happening."
> >
> >
> > The illusions spanned the course, which is to say they touched upon
> > many different causes. For example, the Hermann grid variations,
> > including the "disappearing dots" one that went viral this summer/fall
> > were affected, as well as the color constancy and size constancy ones
> > like the checkershadow illusion, Ames room, etc.
> >
> >
> > What do you all know about this, like what the cause could be for this
> > immunity from illusions of many kinds, or individual variation in the
> > experience of illusions?
> >
> >
> > Best,
> > Katherine
> >
> > Katherine S Moore
> > Assistant Professor of Psychology
> > Arcadia University
> > 450 S. Easton Rd
> > Glenside, PA 19038
> > Office: Boyer Hall room 128
> > Phone: (215) 517-2429
> > https://sites.google.com/a/arcadia.edu/amclab/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > http://visionscience.com/mailman/listinfo/visionlist_visionscience.com
> >
>
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> Andrei Gorea
> *Laboratoire Psychologie de la Perception (LPP)*, UMR 8242
> Université Paris Descartes & CNRS
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>
> Tel. office:    (33 1) 4286 4313
>
> URL:     http://andrei.gorea.free.fr/
>          http://lpp.psycho.univ-paris5.fr/
>
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